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Topic ID 6956

01/01/2013 by matiandmarco

Happy New Year!

I was walking in town this afternoon and although it was fairly quiet, there seemed to be a heavy presence of parking attendants. I saw a number of cars being issued with tickets for parking on a single yellow line. They were not causing any kind of obstruction. I know that the law is the law but why is there such a heavy presence on New Years Day? All the parking in Hertford is free on bank holidays so its not even if the council is losing revenue. It all seemed very petty to me and not really in the spirit of the day. Happy New Years East Herts council!


Replies

Reply ID 91867

01/01/2013 by James007

quote:
Originally posted by matiandmarco
I was walking in town this afternoon and although it was fairly quiet, there seemed to be a heavy presence of parking attendants. I saw a number of cars being issued with tickets for parking on a single yellow line. They were not causing any kind of obstruction. I know that the law is the law but why is there such a heavy presence on New Years Day? All the parking in Hertford is free on bank holidays so its not even if the council is losing revenue. It all seemed very petty to me and not really in the spirit of the day. Happy New Years East Herts council!
I take it that you have just read my post in the Tamworth Road thread. We were in Ware this morning and there were lots of cars with notices on them.


Reply ID 91873

02/01/2013 by Louis M

quote:
Originally posted by matiandmarco
I was walking in town this afternoon and although it was fairly quiet, there seemed to be a heavy presence of parking attendants. I saw a number of cars being issued with tickets for parking on a single yellow line. They were not causing any kind of obstruction. I know that the law is the law but why is there such a heavy presence on New Years Day? All the parking in Hertford is free on bank holidays so its not even if the council is losing revenue. It all seemed very petty to me and not really in the spirit of the day. Happy New Years East Herts council!
Equally as it is free, they could have parked in one of the car parks. Living in a Parking scheme zone, I totally support them.


Reply ID 91875

02/01/2013 by Chalkie

This also happened to us on Boxing Day. We received a parking fine on Nelson Street. I was under the impression that on every bank holiday, you can park on single yellow lines. Very frustrating. Does anyone know the law on this, or is it at the discretion of the Local Authority? Thanks


Reply ID 91877

02/01/2013 by Marilyn

I am sure someone will correct me but I think you have to check the signs by single Yellow lines for the times that the restrictions apply as they vary. Presumably if it says weekdays and does not say bank holidays are exempt then you can't park at restricted times even on a bank holiday!


Reply ID 91878

02/01/2013 by Steve

quote:
Originally posted by Marilyn
I am sure someone will correct me but I think you have to check the signs by single Yellow lines for the times that the restrictions apply as they vary. Presumably if it says weekdays and does not say bank holidays are exempt then you can't park at restricted times even on a bank holiday!
Correct. The signs are definitive. That's why the Parking Attendants photograph the sign as well as the car when issuing PCNs. http://www.parkingticket.co.uk/em.html


Reply ID 91879

02/01/2013 by Chalkie

Thanks Marilyn / Steve......an annoying little fine on top of the Christmas bills! [:D]


Reply ID 91881

02/01/2013 by Arty

Out of interest, I wonder if EHDC have to pay their Parking Attendants premium rates for working on Bank Holidays, and if so, is it cost effective?


Reply ID 91887

02/01/2013 by Steve

quote:
Originally posted by Arty
Out of interest, I wonder if EHDC have to pay their Parking Attendants premium rates for working on Bank Holidays, and if so, is it cost effective?
The Parking Attendants don't work for EHDC


Reply ID 91890

02/01/2013 by Enoughofthat

The principle of privatising taxation raising services has an historical precedent leading to political corruption: http://timesonline.typepad.com/dons_life/2012/08/modern-tax-farming-and-the-roman-dangers-of-private-enterprise.html To support this cause, in 60 Crassus entered an electoral pact (a coalition?) with Pompey the Great and Julius Caesar: they would stick together to get Crassus's friends' tax contract revised, to get Caesar elected to the consulship and to get land found for Pompey's veteran soldiers. It is a political deal now often known as the "First Triumvirate" -- an entirely informal arrangement, but in their confidence that they could gang up privately to rig the Roman political process, it was a harbinger of the dictatorship just around the corner (as some Romans saw).


Reply ID 91891

02/01/2013 by jez_p

Yet another example of policing the letter of the law, rather than the spirit of the law. Presumably the reason for the heavy presence of wardens in the town was because the car-parks were free, there was very little chance of making their targets in them. What is more interesting is that they chose to employ so many wardens on a public holiday. I am guessing that it is a nice little earner for somebody, and I doubt it will benefit the tax-payers of Hertford.


Reply ID 91892

02/01/2013 by shunt

quote:
Originally posted by Arty
Out of interest, I wonder if EHDC have to pay their Parking Attendants premium rates for working on Bank Holidays, and if so, is it cost effective?
There are only two mandatory holiday dates in the year, being Christmas Day and Good Friday. The remainder can be modified by contract. So, if the attendant's contract includes NYD as a normal working day, it can be paid at standard rate.


Reply ID 91893

02/01/2013 by matiandmarco

So I looked at East Herts council and there is no mention of any private company which manages parking [url]http://www.eastherts.gov.uk/index.jsp?articleid=8654[/url] It says: "East Herts Council is responsible for the management of twenty-five car parks across the district and for the enforcement of most parking controls, both in car parks and on-street. This is referred to as 'Civil Parking Enforcement' (CPE). The council also operates a number of Resident Parking schemes." Therefore I take this to mean that they are making these decisions to go hard on a bank holiday, probably for the cynical reasons stated by jez_p Unless someone else can tell me otherwise, I think a letter will be winging its way to East Herts Council pretty soon.


Reply ID 91894

02/01/2013 by Steve

quote:
Originally posted by matiandmarco
So I looked at East Herts council and there is no mention of any private company which manages parking [url]http://www.eastherts.gov.uk/index.jsp?articleid=8654[/url] It says: "East Herts Council is responsible for the management of twenty-five car parks across the district and for the enforcement of most parking controls, both in car parks and on-street. This is referred to as 'Civil Parking Enforcement' (CPE). The council also operates a number of Resident Parking schemes." Therefore I take this to mean that they are making these decisions to go hard on a bank holiday, probably for the cynical reasons stated by jez_p Unless someone else can tell me otherwise, I think a letter will be winging its way to East Herts Council pretty soon.
The Parking Attendants work for NSL, who signed a five year contract with the council in October 2011 http://www.eastherts.gov.uk/index.jsp?articleid=8654[/url]


Reply ID 91896

02/01/2013 by shunt

quote:
Originally posted by Steve
quote:
Originally posted by matiandmarco
So I looked at East Herts council and there is no mention of any private company which manages parking [url]http://www.eastherts.gov.uk/index.jsp?articleid=8654[/url] It says: "East Herts Council is responsible for the management of twenty-five car parks across the district and for the enforcement of most parking controls, both in car parks and on-street. This is referred to as 'Civil Parking Enforcement' (CPE). The council also operates a number of Resident Parking schemes." Therefore I take this to mean that they are making these decisions to go hard on a bank holiday, probably for the cynical reasons stated by jez_p Unless someone else can tell me otherwise, I think a letter will be winging its way to East Herts Council pretty soon.
The Parking Attendants work for NSL, who signed a five year contract with the council in October 2011 http://www.eastherts.gov.uk/index.jsp?articleid=8654[/url]
You are correct, however the client/supplier relationship is between the public and EHC, whoever they sub-contract services to, so matiandmarco's complaint would still be properly addressed to EHC. It would then be EHC's responsibility to take that up with the contractor if required.


Reply ID 91899

02/01/2013 by james

Crap parking is crap parking, whatever day of the year it is. Baffles me when people get tickets and then try to justify it. In 20 years of driving I have never received a parking ticket. I don't consider this to be somekind of amazing skill, just an ability to read signs and use common sense.


Reply ID 91906

02/01/2013 by Mrs T

I agree with James, I've been driving for 30 years and had 1 ticket in 1985. Never made that mistake again, assume nothing read the signs. Simples!![:D]


Reply ID 91907

02/01/2013 by bradman

Have to agree with James - it's not hard to avoid the fine if you observe the rules of the road, though I am sorry the original poster has incurred an annoying fine at a particularly expensive time of the year.


Reply ID 91910

02/01/2013 by night owl

The problem is in some towns you are allowed to park on yellow lines on bank holidays and Sundays and this was how it use to be across the whole country until some pilchard at a council realised that they could make money by catching people out on a Sunday and there are a lot of people still unaware of these new parking rules even though this has been going on for some years now. These traffic wardens cover other towns beside Hertford and it sounds like they were doing town after town, so a driver goes and parks in town on a yellow line and no traffic wardens can be seen and think they are safe then the wardens return and on go the tickets.


Reply ID 91921

03/01/2013 by Drama Queen

Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!


Reply ID 91927

03/01/2013 by buzz

quote:
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!
I agree with most of your sentiments regarding the civil enforcement people. However, the town was pretty chaotic when there were no traffic wardens. IMHO, we were better off with our Police employed Traffic Wardens. They were local to the town, knew all the shopkeepers, were not just out to ticket people, and kept the traffic flowing. Furthermore, they had the authority to direct traffic, which these present people don't have. They used to help out at accidents, breakdowns, parades etc, where some sort of traffic control was needed. A sad day when they were disbanded.


Reply ID 91928

03/01/2013 by Moulder

quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!
I agree with most of your sentiments regarding the civil enforcement people. However, the town was pretty chaotic when there were no traffic wardens. IMHO, we were better off with our Police employed Traffic Wardens. They were local to the town, knew all the shopkeepers, were not just out to ticket people, and kept the traffic flowing. Furthermore, they had the authority to direct traffic, which these present people don't have. They used to help out at accidents, breakdowns, parades etc, where some sort of traffic control was needed. A sad day when they were disbanded.
Indeed it was Buzz - still a few of them retrained as PCSOs so all is not lost eh? [;)]


Reply ID 91946

03/01/2013 by buzz

quote:
Originally posted by Moulder
quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!
I agree with most of your sentiments regarding the civil enforcement people. However, the town was pretty chaotic when there were no traffic wardens. IMHO, we were better off with our Police employed Traffic Wardens. They were local to the town, knew all the shopkeepers, were not just out to ticket people, and kept the traffic flowing. Furthermore, they had the authority to direct traffic, which these present people don't have. They used to help out at accidents, breakdowns, parades etc, where some sort of traffic control was needed. A sad day when they were disbanded.
Indeed it was Buzz - still a few of them retrained as PCSOs so all is not lost eh? [;)]
Really? How many in East Herts, and can you validate that?


Reply ID 91953

03/01/2013 by Steve

quote:
Really? How many in East Herts, and can you validate that?
[:o)]


Reply ID 91960

04/01/2013 by bigbloke

quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Moulder
quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!
I agree with most of your sentiments regarding the civil enforcement people. However, the town was pretty chaotic when there were no traffic wardens. IMHO, we were better off with our Police employed Traffic Wardens. They were local to the town, knew all the shopkeepers, were not just out to ticket people, and kept the traffic flowing. Furthermore, they had the authority to direct traffic, which these present people don't have. They used to help out at accidents, breakdowns, parades etc, where some sort of traffic control was needed. A sad day when they were disbanded.
Indeed it was Buzz - still a few of them retrained as PCSOs so all is not lost eh? [;)]
Really? How many in East Herts, and can you validate that?
Oh dear Buzz, you really don't like your leg being pulled do you?


Reply ID 91964

04/01/2013 by buzz

quote:
Originally posted by bigbloke
quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Moulder
quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!
I agree with most of your sentiments regarding the civil enforcement people. However, the town was pretty chaotic when there were no traffic wardens. IMHO, we were better off with our Police employed Traffic Wardens. They were local to the town, knew all the shopkeepers, were not just out to ticket people, and kept the traffic flowing. Furthermore, they had the authority to direct traffic, which these present people don't have. They used to help out at accidents, breakdowns, parades etc, where some sort of traffic control was needed. A sad day when they were disbanded.
Indeed it was Buzz - still a few of them retrained as PCSOs so all is not lost eh? [;)]
Really? How many in East Herts, and can you validate that?
Oh dear Buzz, you really don't like your leg being pulled do you?
And obviously, neither do you!


Reply ID 91967

04/01/2013 by Marilyn

I think the moral of the story is if you don't want a parking fine don't risk parking on yellow lines at ANY time!


Reply ID 91971

04/01/2013 by buzz

[quote]Originally posted by Marilyn
I think the moral of the story is if you don't want a parking fine don't risk parking on yellow lines at ANY time! [/quote Indeed. Check the signs every time! I have been driving for 50 years and have never had a parking ticket!


Reply ID 91973

04/01/2013 by james

And just to mix things up a bit further, this from the BBC today. [url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20907309[/url] However, it should be noted that the research was done by Labour, so may not be the most independent of studies.


Reply ID 91976

04/01/2013 by Marilyn

quote:
Originally posted by buzz
[quote]Originally posted by Marilyn
I think the moral of the story is if you don't want a parking fine don't risk parking on yellow lines at ANY time! [/quote Indeed. Check the signs every time! I have been driving for 50 years and have never had a parking ticket!
I didn't want to say that but neither have I.....I have been driving 30 years..........except one in the multi-story when the ticket dropped off the windscreen and the rescinded that when I sent them the valid ticket.


Reply ID 92010

05/01/2013 by bigbloke

quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by bigbloke
quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Moulder
quote:
Originally posted by buzz
quote:
Originally posted by Drama Queen
Lets just say, they're not traffic wardens, they don't care about keeping traffic moving and out of the places it shouldn't be, they are revenue collecting machines, that really only are interesting in raking in as much money for their council employers as they can manage. If there is ever a traffic obstruction you can bet a traffic warden won't be around to move it on! I think we existed better when we didn't have them about 10 years ago between the changeover from police control to council. Oh ha[ppy days.. I am sorry people got caught out. I think parking issues in the town are made a lot worse by these "Traffic Wardens" and I personally think its successfully killing our town... but that's another forum post I guess!
I agree with most of your sentiments regarding the civil enforcement people. However, the town was pretty chaotic when there were no traffic wardens. IMHO, we were better off with our Police employed Traffic Wardens. They were local to the town, knew all the shopkeepers, were not just out to ticket people, and kept the traffic flowing. Furthermore, they had the authority to direct traffic, which these present people don't have. They used to help out at accidents, breakdowns, parades etc, where some sort of traffic control was needed. A sad day when they were disbanded.
Indeed it was Buzz - still a few of them retrained as PCSOs so all is not lost eh? [;)]
Really? How many in East Herts, and can you validate that?
Oh dear Buzz, you really don't like your leg being pulled do you?
And obviously, neither do you!
[:p]



Reply ID 92111

10/01/2013 by dennismoore

According to that link, E.Herts is spending more on maintaining car parks than it makes out of all charges.


Reply ID 92113

10/01/2013 by Louis M

I would imagine that a huge chunk of the cost were for the refurb of Gascoyne way. I also wonder if the permit schemes are heavily subsidised and actually lose money.


Reply ID 92114

10/01/2013 by James007

quote:
Originally posted by Louis M
I would imagine that a huge chunk of the cost were for the refurb of Gascoyne way. I also wonder if the permit schemes are heavily subsidised and actually lose money.
Gascoyne Way refurb? The road hasn't been touched since a wall fell down outside the church.


Reply ID 92115

10/01/2013 by Louis M

The car park was painted white etc.


Reply ID 92117

10/01/2013 by James007

What's that got to do with Gascoyne Way?


Reply ID 92119

10/01/2013 by james

Think he means Gascoyne Way car park.. Not surpising though, as believe it or not, the cost of motoring has been subsidised for years. If councils are losing money on parking and can't recover it through council tax due to a freeze, then they're going to try and get their revenue from somewhere else. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/dec/25/car-pollution-noise-accidents-eu?INTCMP=SRCH That's not the only study I've read about. Read about a similar one from a couple of years ago, but can't find the link right now.


Reply ID 92120

10/01/2013 by Steve

quote:
Originally posted by James007
quote:
Originally posted by Louis M
I would imagine that a huge chunk of the cost were for the refurb of Gascoyne way. I also wonder if the permit schemes are heavily subsidised and actually lose money.
Gascoyne Way refurb? The road hasn't been touched since a wall fell down outside the church.
Louis is clearly referring to the refurbishment of the Gascoyne Way multi-storey car park. http://www.hertford.net/blog/default.asp?id=832


Reply ID 92121

10/01/2013 by James007

quote:
Originally posted by Steve
quote:
Originally posted by James007
quote:
Originally posted by Louis M
I would imagine that a huge chunk of the cost were for the refurb of Gascoyne way. I also wonder if the permit schemes are heavily subsidised and actually lose money.
Gascoyne Way refurb? The road hasn't been touched since a wall fell down outside the church.
Louis is clearly referring to the refurbishment of the Gascoyne Way multi-storey car park. http://www.hertford.net/blog/default.asp?id=832
It wasn't clear. Gascoyne Way is part of the A414 running through the town.


Reply ID 92124

10/01/2013 by Razor

Seeing as this whole topic is about car parking related issues I think it was actually pretty obvious to most what he meant!


Reply ID 92125

10/01/2013 by James007

quote:
Originally posted by Razor
Seeing as this whole topic is about car parking related issues I think it was actually pretty obvious to most what he meant!
Gascoyne Way is a car park. [:)]


Reply ID 92126

10/01/2013 by cromwell106

Hi - Really important to let your elected representative know of your unhappiness and remind them of your voting power = if they can't control when/what/where sanity prevails then they are not up to the job!!


Reply ID 92127

10/01/2013 by Leo Densian

Out of interest does the £4.7m loss include payment to the outfit supplying the parking wardens?


43 replies