Topic ID 5792
According to yesterday's Sunday Times that's the annnual salary of Hertfordshire County Council's Chief executive ! No names mentioned. Driving along the B1000 this morning I wondered..."is she/he really worth it" ? The B1000..... From Sele Farm to Tewinbury Farm, verges littered with rubbish that has been there for week upon week. The triangle at The Hollybushes. Junction of Hertford Rd and the Bramfield Rd....three sign posts leaning dangerously toward the roadway. The Highways Department promised to address this by the end of July 2010.....needless to say.....ZILCH ! A £50,000 reduction in your salary may solve the litter problem and keep two litter-pickers gainfully employed for the next 12 months.....
Reply ID 79497
From a procurement perspective.....you gets what you pays for. Good procurers and supplier managers naturally look for greater salaries, as most people do. If Councils pay less then they will tend to end up with those who either want to work locally, have a sense of civic duty and love what they do or simply are not good enough to achieve greater salaries elsewhere. Hence council procurement is often easy prey for a sophisticated sales team, even if the processes and beaurocracy that underpin them are best practice. It is the same for CEO's and others in positions of responsibility at the council. Chief executives of organisations that employ thousands of people earn £100k+, £200k+ and much, much more. Yet people expect them to earn the same as bus drivers. The amount of responsibility on the shoulders of the CEO is immense and those who criticize tend to be those who have no understanding of this. Yeah, things will go wrong and it is easy picking to look around as we drive to work and pick fault. Frankly most people are not able to do such a job. If we expect the CEO to be of a calibre sufficient to manage a workforce of thousands and all the responsibility that goes with the role then we should expect to pay them appropriately, otherwise those people will work elsewhere to earn the salary their skills command. Regarding the problems on the B100, etc.........contact the council and get it sorted. That's what they are there for. And if they fail in their duties, escalate the matter.
Reply ID 79501
quote:Hear hear. I couldn't agree more. Mind you, I suppose there's alwys The Big Society. Take that to its limits and we can do away with the Council altogether. Then we'll see.
Originally posted by Ewoowar
Chief executives of organisations that employ thousands of people earn £100k+, £200k+ and much, much more. Yet people expect them to earn the same as bus drivers. The amount of responsibility on the shoulders of the CEO is immense and those who criticize tend to be those who have no understanding of this. Yeah, things will go wrong and it is easy picking to look around as we drive to work and pick fault. Frankly most people are not able to do such a job. If we expect the CEO to be of a calibre sufficient to manage a workforce of thousands and all the responsibility that goes with the role then we should expect to pay them appropriately, otherwise those people will work elsewhere to earn the salary their skills command.
Reply ID 79563
It's an obscene salary and what's more it's OUR money! Even the tories now agree: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12473979 He (Eric Pickles, communities secretary) said a survey suggested that chief executive pay had increased within five years - including performance related pay and bonuses - by 78%: "I don't think that's a system we should be particularly proud of." £203,000 is more than even David Cameron gets.
Reply ID 79566
quote:Comparing council officer salaries with the PM's is spurious, the real comparaison is with senior civil servants such as permananent Secretaries. You require skills to be an officer, you don't need any to be an elected politician.
Originally posted by dennismoore
It's an obscene salary and what's more it's OUR money! Even the tories now agree: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12473979 He (Eric Pickles, communities secretary) said a survey suggested that chief executive pay had increased within five years - including performance related pay and bonuses - by 78%: "I don't think that's a system we should be particularly proud of." £203,000 is more than even David Cameron gets.
Reply ID 79568
If you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. I think that if the man or woman in charge gets £203,000 then that is ok. The council do not pay lots of money to be nice to someone, they pay it to get people that can do the job. If they could pay £150,000 and get the same level of CEO then I'm sure they would. I also think that MP's get paid too little. For the job we expect them to do they are not well paid. If we paid more, paid for one or two staff and stopped them having to claim all sorts of odd payments for staples, rent and taxis, they could concentrate on legislation - not trying to secure some well paid job for when they leave or get kicked out.
Reply ID 79647
"From a procurement perspective"......£203,000; excluding holidays and pension (?), that should produce the VERY best and the very best should be able to delegate responsibilties right down the scale to the lowest paid unskilled worker. If they fail in car parking issues (!)...rubbish collection an so on and so forth at the expense of a multi-storey car park for a town that is in decline; well, they are failing dismally ! Why should I have to chase up the highways department to clear up litter and repair lethal and derelict road signs ? For £203,000 our chief executive should get off his/her butt and take a look at our County Town. I am sure that some smart ass will provide a smart answer regarding procurement perspective but the final analysis is down to results and as far as Hertford is concerned it is shambolic !
Reply ID 79651
quote:Tiger...........when you've quite finished insulting me and calling me a smart arse perhaps you should take a few minutes to seriously consider whether you should ever bother posting your opinions on a publicily accessible forum if you cannot accept a perfectly reasoned, lucid and non-insulting response. I based my comment on my own personal experience. You have reached the glorious heights of responding withy a rant and an insult.
Originally posted by tiger.1000
"From a procurement perspective"......£203,000; excluding holidays and pension (?), that should produce the VERY best and the very best should be able to delegate responsibilties right down the scale to the lowest paid unskilled worker. If they fail in car parking issues (!)...rubbish collection an so on and so forth at the expense of a multi-storey car park for a town that is in decline; well, they are failing dismally ! Why should I have to chase up the highways department to clear up litter and repair lethal and derelict road signs ? For £203,000 our chief executive should get off his/her butt and take a look at our County Town. I am sure that some smart ass will provide a smart answer regarding procurement perspective but the final analysis is down to results and as far as Hertford is concerned it is shambolic !
Reply ID 79653
Getting off their butt and going for a ride round Hertford to see where there is litter and damaged road signs is not really the way to lead a council. Is that really how they should spend their time?
Reply ID 79654
quote:I suggest you check your ill-informed facts as to which organisation owns what and who does what before you post Tiger. ie; the car park is EHDC and Highways is HCC.
Originally posted by tiger.1000
"From a procurement perspective"......£203,000; excluding holidays and pension (?), that should produce the VERY best and the very best should be able to delegate responsibilties right down the scale to the lowest paid unskilled worker. If they fail in car parking issues (!)...rubbish collection an so on and so forth at the expense of a multi-storey car park for a town that is in decline; well, they are failing dismally ! Why should I have to chase up the highways department to clear up litter and repair lethal and derelict road signs ? For £203,000 our chief executive should get off his/her butt and take a look at our County Town. I am sure that some smart ass will provide a smart answer regarding procurement perspective but the final analysis is down to results and as far as Hertford is concerned it is shambolic !
Reply ID 79656
Ewoowar...look before you leap ! I said "will", not "did"! One's in the past and the former in the future ! I feel sure that if you think that you are worthy of rants and insults, someone will respond accordingly.....
Reply ID 79659
quote:I know what you wrote and it was with a clear and direct reference to my post. I don't feel worthy of rants and insults, which is why I have objected to your comment. I posted a reasoned and rational response to your original post and you appear capable only of irrational, unreasoned and insulting responses. If you are capable of a mature and reasoned dialogue on what is the worthwhile subject for debate that you have raised then please continue. If, however, you wish to continue unreasonably and argumentatively then I request you refrain from your aggressive approach.
Originally posted by tiger.1000
Ewoowar...look before you leap ! I said "will", not "did"! One's in the past and the former in the future ! I feel sure that if you think that you are worthy of rants and insults, someone will respond accordingly.....
Reply ID 79660
There's no doubting what I wrote but you shouldn't jump to conclusions ! The Bush- Blair alliance made a similar mistake over weapons of mass destruction. However you've got to hand it to them they have got rich very quick..... So on the basis of you only get what you're paying for,our Chief Exec should be good only Tony. AGREED ?
Reply ID 79661
quote:That's not how I read it.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:I know what you wrote and it was with a clear and direct reference to my post.
Originally posted by tiger.1000
Ewoowar...look before you leap ! I said "will", not "did"! One's in the past and the former in the future ! I feel sure that if you think that you are worthy of rants and insults, someone will respond accordingly.....
Reply ID 79663
So Billywindsock...you reckon that riding around looking for litter and damaged road signs is no way to lead a council ? Why not ? A picture of the Chief Exec in The mercury doing EXACTLY that might just gee-up some of the "administrators"; "department managers" and other jobsworths who get paid 40 hours wages for 10 hours work. Don't our PM's occasionally go to the inner cities and mingle with the workers and ethnic minorities; take a look at how we ordinary folk exist ? Well, if they can so can our Chief Exec !
Reply ID 79664
quote:Steve.......Tiger1000 even directly quoted me. Anyway............I'm not going to even waste my time opening this thread again. Tiger1000 is incapable of reasoned debate and seems to be the sort of person capable of starting a fight in an empty room. Good luck.
Originally posted by Stevequote:That's not how I read it.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:I know what you wrote and it was with a clear and direct reference to my post.
Originally posted by tiger.1000
Ewoowar...look before you leap ! I said "will", not "did"! One's in the past and the former in the future ! I feel sure that if you think that you are worthy of rants and insults, someone will respond accordingly.....
Reply ID 79665
Ewoowar....other than tell me that our chief executive is worth £203,000 per annum (excluding holidays and pension); other than criticise my method of debate, what useful contribution have you actually made ? None as far as I can see ! I have put forward a proposal for having rubbish cleared and dangerous sign posts repaired. All of this seems to have gone right over your head ! Interestingly, the Highways Department DID promise to attend to the road signs at the Bramfield Rd by the end of July 2010 but this has been conveniently overlooked and put on the back-burner. Perhaps when there IS a collision and injury between a cyclist or a car they may do something about it.....£0000000?s court case. They can't say they havn't been told. ! As far as the B1000 is concerned. Yes, I drive along there every day and regardless of calls to the council, it still remains the same filthy mess. Of course the B1000 is just ONE road...there are hundreds of others in exactly the same state. In simple terms, our chief exec on £203,000 per annum is on the top of the ladder and I assume directly responsible for all of those answerable to her/him. In my opinion we need regime change !
Reply ID 79707
In regards to the litter, there has been recent action in clearing the highways.
Reply ID 79744
Are you saying it's been "actioned"....or they're thinking about it ?
Reply ID 79749
quote:Do you work for the Local Authority?!!
Originally posted by Ewoowar
From a procurement perspective.....you gets what you pays for. Good procurers and supplier managers naturally look for greater salaries, as most people do. If Councils pay less then they will tend to end up with those who either want to work locally, have a sense of civic duty and love what they do or simply are not good enough to achieve greater salaries elsewhere. Hence council procurement is often easy prey for a sophisticated sales team, even if the processes and beaurocracy that underpin them are best practice. It is the same for CEO's and others in positions of responsibility at the council. Chief executives of organisations that employ thousands of people earn £100k+, £200k+ and much, much more. Yet people expect them to earn the same as bus drivers. The amount of responsibility on the shoulders of the CEO is immense and those who criticize tend to be those who have no understanding of this. Yeah, things will go wrong and it is easy picking to look around as we drive to work and pick fault. Frankly most people are not able to do such a job. If we expect the CEO to be of a calibre sufficient to manage a workforce of thousands and all the responsibility that goes with the role then we should expect to pay them appropriately, otherwise those people will work elsewhere to earn the salary their skills command. Regarding the problems on the B100, etc.........contact the council and get it sorted. That's what they are there for. And if they fail in their duties, escalate the matter.
Reply ID 79750
Kitty Kat.....you just beat me to it ! Surely EOOOWWWAAARRR isn't you know who ! It actually does make sense ! STEVE...what say you ?