Topic ID 4252
I thought the land by the river Beane (where the Horses were) had been sold to two local fisherman. If this weeks Mercury is to be believed (who knows?) it seems only some of the land has been purchased by a local business man for this purpose. The rest is to be auctioned in the couple months. Seem there was uproar when a traveller friend of the horse owner place a late winning bid for the remaining land. As a result the land has been withdrawn from sale until the new auction is held. Question is what is there to stop the same person bidding again?
Reply ID 61565
Traveller's Bengeo land deal fury sparks move to auction By Danel Phillips A BENGEO beauty spot is to go under the hammer following an uproar sparked by rumours that it was to be sold to travellers. An 'informal' auction was held to sell trust-owned land close to the River Beane that backs on to houses on Molewood Road. But Hertford auctioneer Beesons received a last-minute winning bid from a party from Edmonton believed to be an associate of the man who has kept horses on the site for many years. The animals made the news last month after the RSPCA rescued them from the land which had flooded. Furious residents bombarded the trustees' solicitor, Hertford-based Longmores, with calls protesting against the plans. Concern was so great that Hertford mayor Cllr Kim Darby (Con, Bengeo) also stepped in One resident told the Mercury that a group of householders had toyed with bidding collectively. "Residents don't want to own the land, but it would make sense to buy it to protect their house prices," said the woman, who did not want to be named. "It's such a beautiful area and although obviously we don't own it we don't want to see it go to ruin." Many local residents were keen that it should be sold to a local businessman proposing to convert the area into a trout fishing site. The plan includes cultivation of wildlife and the Mercury understands that neighbouring land had already been acquired for this purpose. Following the uproar last month, the trustees of the Alfred Foskett Will Trust withdrew the land from sale. This week Richard Taylor, of Longmores, said the land will be sold at a public auction in Hertford in the next "couple of months". "There were suggestions that the auction was not keeping to the rules of the tender process," he said. "There was a very late bid that we were satisfied was within the time limit, but we had concerns from the public, including the mayor and councillors. "It was suggested that the land should go to public auction for the purpose of transparency and the trustees have also come to that conclusion." <source Hertfordshire mercury> There has been a bit of activity over on the fields in the last week or so, with a couple of 4 x 4's seen parked - so maybe they are clearing the site?[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/confused/008.gif[/img]
Reply ID 61568
[img]http://www.beesons.uk.com/images/property5.jpg [/img]LAND AT MOLEWOOD ROAD, HERTFORD A freehold block of land comprising 1.388 hectares, 3.42 acres or thereabouts, to the west of Molewood Road, with a frontage of approx 144.5m, 158 yards, to the River Beane and vehicle access from Molewood Road close to the junction with Beane Road. The land lies in Green Belt and Landscape Conservation area. In addition, the land is a Wildlife Site and forms one of Hertford·s Green Fingers. In recent years the land has been grazing for ponies and is fenced and believed stock proof. During prolonged periods of rain the land lies wet. There are no services connected. OFFERS FOR THE FREEHOLD ARE INVITED WITH A GUIDE PRICE OF £50,000. <source Beesons>
Reply ID 61583
I live in the vacinity (although not in one of the houses that actually backs on to the land) and I think it would be in the interests of everyone in the immediate area to have some control over what happens to the land. It seems to me that the best approach would be for all those residents that do back on to the land to purchase it collectively but I guess that may still be quite a high unit cost. If that wasn't workable then extending this to the wider area around Lower Bengeo and Millmead Way would surely attract enough contributors to get the unit price to a workable figure. I would be willing to contribute to a collective bid as I think it's really important to everyone in the local area to secure the future of that land. Does anyone know if there is a move underway to put a collective bid together and who to contact for details?
Reply ID 61591
it sounds like you'll have to arrange such a thing! and the only way to do that is to speak to local people - you're unlikely to get enough coverage on here!
Reply ID 61595
There are signs on the land now saying the property of Bengeo Fishery or words to that effect.
Reply ID 61596
there was a van parked in the middle of the field yesterday, looked like some works or something, but turned out it was a guy lazing in the sun :)
Reply ID 61597
Hi Sbarker Get in touch with the Lower Bengeo Residents Association, they bid for the original piece of land in association with the Herts and Middlesex Wildlife Trust. [email protected] Paul
quote:
Originally posted by Sbarker
I live in the vacinity (although not in one of the houses that actually backs on to the land) and I think it would be in the interests of everyone in the immediate area to have some control over what happens to the land. It seems to me that the best approach would be for all those residents that do back on to the land to purchase it collectively but I guess that may still be quite a high unit cost. If that wasn't workable then extending this to the wider area around Lower Bengeo and Millmead Way would surely attract enough contributors to get the unit price to a workable figure. I would be willing to contribute to a collective bid as I think it's really important to everyone in the local area to secure the future of that land. Does anyone know if there is a move underway to put a collective bid together and who to contact for details?
Reply ID 61598
The portion of the land just sold now belongs to a local (very local) tree surgeon, but much of the recent activity has been in connection with the railway and the clearing of the embankment. The portion immediately behind the houses in Molewood Road is yet to be sold. Strawberry Mead (further down) has belonged to the same family for many years and has been used for light industial purposes (predominately glassfibre moulding). The remainder, adjacent to the narrower part of Molewood Rd, is part of a private garden. Personally, I hope this area doesn't become too tidy or heavily used recreationally. It's prior use impacted very little on it's wild state.
Reply ID 61606
Thanks Paul, I will follow that up. If the local residents could secure ownership then i would think the best option would be to leave it alone in it's natural state safe in the knowledge that the land is secure for the future. Maybe even come to an arrangement with the owners of the adjacent plot to remove the unsightly wire fence that now separates the plots! The land is so open to view from Beane road that it could have a really detrimental effect on the local area if it fell into the wrong hands and became unsightly - especially as its' a major pedestrian route from the station - it is likely to be one of the first things that visitors see when they arrive in Hertford by train. Not to mention the fact that it must currently be a mini haven for certain wildlife. I'm sure in the most extreme cases it could potentially have a significant effect on house prices in the immediate area - certainly the properties that back on to it and in the current climate that's the last thing people need.
Reply ID 61621
yeah it would be good if the residents of lower Bengeo bought the land. 1) so that they could stop travellers buying it and prevent their property from devaluing (very daily mail to pick up on other threads). And 2) they could park their cars there instead of blocking a perfectly useable road (sorry rat run).
Reply ID 61627
http://www.brb.gov.uk/property/property_listings?keyword=river+beane Does anyone know whether this is an old listing?[IMG]http://www.brb.gov.uk/property/property_listings?keyword=river+beane
Reply ID 61633
I spoke to the (very) local tree surgeon the other day. Very keen to try and buy the rest of the land if possible (it seemed). Doesn't want his investment so far ruined and from my impression good luck to him.
Reply ID 61634
quote:Why would travellers want to buy the land? If they bought the land and settled there then, by definition, they would no longer be travellers.
Originally posted by aubend
yeah it would be good if the residents of lower Bengeo bought the land. 1) so that they could stop travellers buying it and prevent their property from devaluing (very daily mail to pick up on other threads). And 2) they could park their cars there instead of blocking a perfectly useable road (sorry rat run).
Reply ID 61635
quote:An option many former travellers take if they can. There's a very tidy and long established settlement in Woollensbrook, next to Bramble Lane.
Originally posted by JohnSmithquote:Why would travellers want to buy the land? If they bought the land and settled there then, by definition, they would no longer be travellers.
Originally posted by aubend
yeah it would be good if the residents of lower Bengeo bought the land. 1) so that they could stop travellers buying it and prevent their property from devaluing (very daily mail to pick up on other threads). And 2) they could park their cars there instead of blocking a perfectly useable road (sorry rat run).
Reply ID 61636
quote:And for every "tidy" settlement there are dozens of others that aren't. If travellers acquire the land they will stick two fingers up to planning regulations and do what they want. The authorities will be too lily-livered to object in case they are accused of racism or discrimination. And the local crime rates will go up.
Originally posted by shuntquote:An option many former travellers take if they can. There's a very tidy and long established settlement in Woollensbrook, next to Bramble Lane.
Originally posted by JohnSmithquote:Why would travellers want to buy the land? If they bought the land and settled there then, by definition, they would no longer be travellers.
Originally posted by aubend
yeah it would be good if the residents of lower Bengeo bought the land. 1) so that they could stop travellers buying it and prevent their property from devaluing (very daily mail to pick up on other threads). And 2) they could park their cars there instead of blocking a perfectly useable road (sorry rat run).
Reply ID 61637
It seems very hypocritical to be called travellers and wanting to live a traveller's life but buy up land! Wouldn't it be ironic if they bought the land and we all set up camp on it!
Reply ID 61638
quote:Maybe so, but then if you'd read this about yourself, you'd be unlikely to respect or care about the opinions of the source.
Originally posted by buzz And for every "tidy" settlement there are dozens of others that aren't. If travellers acquire the land they will stick two fingers up to planning regulations and do what they want. The authorities will be too lily-livered to object in case they are accused of racism or discrimination. And the local crime rates will go up.
Reply ID 61641
quote:Just like a certain property developer with a name not dissimilar to a local estate agent then?!
Originally posted by buzz
If travellers acquire the land they will stick two fingers up to planning regulations and do what they want.
Reply ID 61642
Looks like there's been a run on Daily Mails again... tut [:)]
Reply ID 61643
quote:'Wanting to live a traveller's life'. We're not talking about Alan Whicker here.
Originally posted by JohnSmith
It seems very hypocritical to be called travellers and wanting to live a traveller's life but buy up land! Wouldn't it be ironic if they bought the land and we all set up camp on it!
Reply ID 61646
Has anyone set foot on the said land? Why would anyone want to set up home on a plot of land that is boggy for the majority of the year and flooded for the remainder?
Reply ID 61647
Calling JohnSmith 'an imbecile' then editing it , big brave aubend .
Reply ID 61648
quote:Cheers Dono for that. Changed my mind. Tell tale TIT.
Originally posted by Donostia
Calling JohnSmith 'an imbecile' then editing it , big brave aubend .
Reply ID 61649
The ability to edit posts is provided to enable members to make corrections shortly after posting. Attempts to use this feature to manipulate the forum in any way will be deemed an abuse of this feature. Anyone who edits a post after it has been replied to, or over 12 hours after posting will be deemed to be misusing the feature and appropriate action will be taken.
Reply ID 61651
quote:Editing the slur out was wise. It would have spoilt the humour of the post and turned[:D] into[:o)]and[:I], leading to[:(!] and possibly even[B)].
Originally posted by Donostia
Calling JohnSmith 'an imbecile' then editing it , big brave aubend .
Reply ID 61659
I saw a "suit' on the bridge over the Beane at midday today, taking photographs and "scoping" the fields out with binoculars. It looks like it will be back on the market soon. P
Reply ID 61669
quote:Well, it's unlikely that I'd read it about myself as I don't act in such a way. If you want to have a dreamy pastel coloured view of "travellers", then you carry on. The rest of us live in the real world.
Originally posted by shuntquote:Maybe so, but then if you'd read this about yourself, you'd be unlikely to respect or care about the opinions of the source.
Originally posted by buzz And for every "tidy" settlement there are dozens of others that aren't. If travellers acquire the land they will stick two fingers up to planning regulations and do what they want. The authorities will be too lily-livered to object in case they are accused of racism or discrimination. And the local crime rates will go up.
Reply ID 61671
quote:Who's "us"?
Originally posted by buzzquote:Well, it's unlikely that I'd read it about myself as I don't act in such a way. If you want to have a dreamy pastel coloured view of "travellers", then you carry on. The rest of us live in the real world.
Originally posted by shuntquote:Maybe so, but then if you'd read this about yourself, you'd be unlikely to respect or care about the opinions of the source.
Originally posted by buzz And for every "tidy" settlement there are dozens of others that aren't. If travellers acquire the land they will stick two fingers up to planning regulations and do what they want. The authorities will be too lily-livered to object in case they are accused of racism or discrimination. And the local crime rates will go up.
Reply ID 61673
The locals should club together buy the land and then recoup the cost by growing rice on it[:D]
Reply ID 61676
quote:"Us" are the people who live in the real world, where we pay taxes, conform to the laws of the land, however much we disagree with them, recognise that if we want to live in a democratic ? society we have to obey the rules. Like I said, you carry on with your rose tinted view of gentle Romany travellers. You enjoy your time in cloud cuckoo land
Originally posted by shuntquote:Who's "us"?
Originally posted by buzzquote:Well, it's unlikely that I'd read it about myself as I don't act in such a way. If you want to have a dreamy pastel coloured view of "travellers", then you carry on. The rest of us live in the real world.
Originally posted by shuntquote:Maybe so, but then if you'd read this about yourself, you'd be unlikely to respect or care about the opinions of the source.
Originally posted by buzz And for every "tidy" settlement there are dozens of others that aren't. If travellers acquire the land they will stick two fingers up to planning regulations and do what they want. The authorities will be too lily-livered to object in case they are accused of racism or discrimination. And the local crime rates will go up.
Reply ID 61678
You are funny buzz; Defending a democratic society yet questioning the views of people living within the same democracy.
Reply ID 61680
quote:Well don't really see where you're coming from....but surely the point of a democracy is being able to question the views of others
Originally posted by James007
You are funny buzz; Defending a democratic society yet questioning the views of people living within the same democracy.
Reply ID 61684
Maybe it's me? You questioned Shunt by commenting that you "live in the real world, pay taxes, conform to the laws of the land". You then quote to Shunt, "you enjoy your time in cloud cuckoo land". He works and pays taxes like you and me and, as far I can see, he doesn't really whinge at all. In fact I can't remember a post where Shunt actually moans, I might be wrong. My view on the Beane Road site - if it is sold, it will be worthless as it is deep on a flood plain level 1;no development opportunity. People underestimate the water levels from Waterford to Hertford, the ground is swamped with water. A suicide purchase for development, a dream purchase for local people offering sobriety and peace of mind for those that own it.
Reply ID 61687
quote:Well, you may be party to information that the rest of us don't have, but can you swear on oath that Shunt pays taxes, or is this just an assumption on your part? As for your statement that Shunt doesn't whinge..........perhaps you should join him in cloud cuckoo land
Originally posted by James007
Maybe it's me? You questioned Shunt by commenting that you "live in the real world, pay taxes, conform to the laws of the land". You then quote to Shunt, "you enjoy your time in cloud cuckoo land". He works and pays taxes like you and me and, as far I can see, he doesn't really whinge at all. In fact I can't remember a post where Shunt actually moans, I might be wrong. My view on the Beane Road site - if it is sold, it will be worthless as it is deep on a flood plain level 1;no development opportunity. People underestimate the water levels from Waterford to Hertford, the ground is swamped with water. A suicide purchase for development, a dream purchase for local people offering sobriety and peace of mind for those that own it.
Reply ID 61692
Anywaaayy...<deep breath> back on topic, eh? Whoever buys it, it can't just be left to look after itself. What about: - Insurance for trespassers who go for a wander and hurt themselves/drown. - Maintaining boundary fences effectiveness & safety. - A wildlife haven needs tending, not neglect. There will need to be careful and judicious work encouraging/retaining various species. Neglect can be be interpreted that no-one owns or keeps an eye on it. - Should people wander through the wildlife haven or just admire it from afar? --If wandering through, how do you restrict their roaming and make sure they give the area the proper respect? --If from afar, 7 years worth of interlopers moving along a particular route will create a 'footpath' which can be enforceable if enough proof of the continued used of the route can be dredged up. - Ongoing rubbish removal. There's more than the one off cost of buying the land. Also bear in mind that the Port Hill/Vale railway cutting running went on at £60k each and went for (I think) £160k each and that has been deemed 'undevelopable' also.
Reply ID 61694
The difficulty with tended wildlife havens which people walk through is that they are not really wild and too often disturbed to be of value to wildlife. The beauty of this place was that nobody went there, nobody mowed anything or cleared fallen trees. No dogs, no ramblers, footballers, fishermen, or children. The balance of the river was just as it happened (big pike, small trout) as opposed to the way fishermen like it (no pike, big trout), the swans, ducks, cootes, pheasants, voles, mice, warblers, all breed in peace (except those eaten by the pike). This is what Hartham was like, before they ruined it.
Reply ID 61695
quote:I don't see the relevence of tax being mentioned. In a civilised, democratic society, no authority or status is gained by being compelled to pay tax. It just means you're lucky enough to be relatively rich. I am fortunate enough to be subject to taxation.
Originally posted by buzzquote:Well, you may be party to information that the rest of us don't have, but can you swear on oath that Shunt pays taxes, or is this just an assumption on your part? As for your statement that Shunt doesn't whinge..........perhaps you should join him in cloud cuckoo land
Originally posted by James007
Maybe it's me? You questioned Shunt by commenting that you "live in the real world, pay taxes, conform to the laws of the land". You then quote to Shunt, "you enjoy your time in cloud cuckoo land". He works and pays taxes like you and me and, as far I can see, he doesn't really whinge at all. In fact I can't remember a post where Shunt actually moans, I might be wrong. My view on the Beane Road site - if it is sold, it will be worthless as it is deep on a flood plain level 1;no development opportunity. People underestimate the water levels from Waterford to Hertford, the ground is swamped with water. A suicide purchase for development, a dream purchase for local people offering sobriety and peace of mind for those that own it.
Reply ID 61713
As I said when I stated this topic is there anything to stop the Travellers who are said to placed the original winning bid from out bidding everyone else at the public auction? Or can the trust refuse the bid just because of who they are?
Reply ID 61716
I can’t see how, legally or ethically, they can discriminate against one party over another in a public auction.
Reply ID 61717
would travellers be allowed to occupy it given that it regularly floods?
Reply ID 61718
come to think of it, they never normaly ask before occupying land. However, if they've paid a large sum for the land, they are more likely to respect it, surely?
Reply ID 61720
That is exactly my point Quatermass. It was said there was uproar when the travellers made a last minute winning bid so it was withdrawn from sale. If that is their right then so be it but I can’t see how they can offer it at a public auction but then pick and choose who it is sold to. The next thing you know the travellers will be suing for discrimination. Or am I missing something here?
Reply ID 61721
It does make you wonder for what purpose the travellers intend to purchase the land. You do read for them buying large plots and then rapidly building an (often illegal) infrastructure but surly not on a swamp like this.
Reply ID 61725
quote:......and therefor would not be 'travellers', having arrived and at least in part, conformed to mainstream. [;)]
Originally posted by thefair1973
come to think of it, they never normaly ask before occupying land. However, if they've paid a large sum for the land, they are more likely to respect it, surely?
Reply ID 61726
Perhaps they want to build their retirement homes there. ‘Dunromin by the Beane’[:D]
Reply ID 61732
There's a lot of assumption and prejudice being shown here. Not all travellers are responsible for badly tarmacked drives or stealing drain covers. Just as not all estate agents are guilty of being slimy charlatans.
Reply ID 61733
quote:Indeed. Just like Staffordshire Bull Terriers are not all yobs status symbols or Hertford is not just a chav town etc. [;)]
Originally posted by aubend
There's a lot of assumption and prejudice being shown here. Not all travellers are responsible for badly tarmacked drives or stealing drain covers. Just as not all estate agents are guilty of being slimy charlatans.
Reply ID 61734
well done Leo. Keep up the good work.
Reply ID 61879
True enough aubend., but the travellers are not renowned for the countryside conservation work. I just question why they are willing to pay good money for what in essence is marsh land. It could simply be to keep their Horses on, if so then fair play to them. I do how ever find it difficult to assimilate the words ‘Travelling community’ & Permanent site’
Reply ID 62270
Just seen this on Beeson's site: LAND AT MOLEWOOD ROAD, HERTFORD A freehold block of land comprising 1.388 hectares, 3.42 acres or thereabouts, to the west of Molewood Road, with a frontage of approx 144.5m, 158 yards, to the River Beane and vehicle access from Molewood Road close to the junction with Beane Road. The land lies in Green Belt and Landscape Conservation area. In addition, the land is a Wildlife Site and forms one of Hertford·s Green Fingers. In recent years the land has been grazing for ponies and is fenced and believed stock proof. During prolonged periods of rain the land lies wet. There are no services connected. PUBLIC AUCTION - SALISBURY ARMS HOTEL, HERTFORD 3.30pm WEDNESDAY 22 APRIL 2009 [img] http://www.beesons.uk.com/images/property5.jpg[/img] and now we wait...[img]http://www.beesons.uk.com/images/property5.jpg[/img]
Reply ID 62742
The auction is this Wednesday
Reply ID 62751
So, from the Mercury its for sale this Wednesday, has anybody heard any word on local groups looking to buy it to safe guard it? I'm happy to make a contribution but need someone to contribute to. I've emailed the Lower Bengeo Residents Association to see if they're making any moves in that direction.
Reply ID 62764
During prolonged periods of rain the land lies wet Shouldnt that say after 5 minutes of rain .... Looks very tidy in todays sunshine .
Reply ID 62821
any news on the auction
Reply ID 62874
quote:Joy as 'green finger' sold to local businessman. I am not sure if this link will work - but the land has been bought by a local businessman, http://edition.pagesuite-professional.co.uk/Launch.aspx?referral=other&refresh=p04J6Y1nD1m7&PBID=c38defde-d742-4f96-91a6-f8c02568ed3a it is on page 3 righthand side [:D]
Originally posted by JohnS
any news on the auction
Reply ID 62882
quote:So, would you like to give examples.....in either category
Originally posted by aubend
There's a lot of assumption and prejudice being shown here. Not all travellers are responsible for badly tarmacked drives or stealing drain covers. Just as not all estate agents are guilty of being slimy charlatans.
Reply ID 63015
I see that the fishermen have bought the land I think for about £46,000 well done Mick!
Reply ID 63021
quote:Mick...., I thought the guy that bought the land was called Luke Gifkins[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/confused/040.gif[/img] There was quite a bit of activity yesterday on the fields - cars and folk. I guess now there will be some kind of maintenance programme for the site... which is good for the wildlife and for visual appeal.[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/confused/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by furrybunny
I see that the fishermen have bought the land I think for about £46,000 well done Mick!
Reply ID 63024
Jaycee there are two of them buying it for trout fishing, but I am just glad it went for fishing.......I did hear that the travellers did put a bid in but could not raise the money...shame, still never mind....
Reply ID 63027
quote:Sorry FB - I stand corrected![img]http://www.moppo.net/links/193763001240998527-final.gif[/img] Oh yes, <cough> and the other little item.. yes, shame indeed.
Originally posted by furrybunny
Jaycee there are two of them buying it for trout fishing, but I am just glad it went for fishing.......I did hear that the travellers did put a bid in but could not raise the money...shame, still never mind....
Reply ID 63758
I see horses are back on the Beane marsh, up the railway end. P
Reply ID 63762
Yes but are they the same horses & the same owner?
Reply ID 63764
Spotted Mick the other day and stopped for a chat. Completely forgot to ask why the land was mowed. Seems a shame to loose the cover and wildlife habitat, if all is wanted is water to fish in.
Reply ID 63838
Probably to stop plants like nettles flowering and throwing seeds over all the places Mick and co don't want them.
Reply ID 63839
quote:Exactly.
Originally posted by Falstaff
Probably to stop plants like nettles flowering and throwing seeds over all the places Mick and co don't want them.
Reply ID 63868
Was it really just to get rid of nettles? It's a shame to see great swathes of unspoilt marshland being mown down like that if that was the only reason. Or were there sound ecological reasons for doing so?
Reply ID 63870
quote:It's a combination of rough grasses, nettles, thistle and marshmallow which provides cover for nesting waterfoul, insects, molluscs and rodents of many types. Hopefully, the mowing is just to provide initial access and it will be left to grow next year with only paths to fishing spots. The banks don't provide much cover as they stand. [/quote]
Originally posted by dennismoore
Was it really just to get rid of nettles? It's a shame to see great swathes of unspoilt marshland being mown down like that if that was the only reason. Or were there sound ecological reasons for doing so?
Reply ID 63871
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63872
quote:Totally agree - it certainly looks better, and if the mowing is to keep things (plants, etc) in check - i hope they watch out for Ragwort - as mowing does not get rid of this dreadful invasive plant - it has to be destroyed - taken away and burned, after removing roots and tubers.. as it is potentially lethal if eaten by horses!*J*[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/nature/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63874
quote:That's the problem. Too much of our traditional meadow is being converted to lawn for the sake of urban neatness of appearance, just look at Hartham and how that habitat has been destroyed by mowing and football pitches. Little Johnny get to play footy and Mrs Glam can walk her Highland terrier child substitute without getting her shoes muddy, but neither will see anything of interest whilst doing so.
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63876
quote:I can't think of anything more harmful to wildlife than making the countryside "look nice". Consider the impact there's been on our songbird population in recent years. The bit of land nearest Molewood Road used to be covered in long grasses etc and was a haven for all kinds of small animals. I hope the these people know what they're doing. As for Hartham, I agree with you Shunt, but at least Hartham is land that we can all use for recreation, whereas the land by Beane Road remains a privately owned no-go area.
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63878
Perhaps you should speak to the guys that have brought this piece of land before making comments. There are always people too willing to have a pop before they know exactly what is happening and never enough to praise good work.
Reply ID 63880
As I asked before: Are there sound ecological reasons for doing what they're doing? It looks destructive but I sincerely hope it isn't. If I knew them then I'd ask.
Reply ID 63882
quote:The jury is still out on Ragwort killing horses, as far as I have been able to research. It's a rumour amongst equestrian circles, with some, as yet, unproven evidence that seems to suggest a link. However, even if it is true, we can't design the natural world just to suit horses.
Originally posted by Jayceequote:Totally agree - it certainly looks better, and if the mowing is to keep things (plants, etc) in check - i hope they watch out for Ragwort - as mowing does not get rid of this dreadful invasive plant - it has to be destroyed - taken away and burned, after removing roots and tubers.. as it is potentially lethal if eaten by horses!*J*[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/nature/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63883
quote:Like I said, I forgot to ask when I saw Mick and it may be just a temporary convenience to aid the clear up of rubbish. If so, it will recover within a year. I was expressing a hope, not a critism, that this doesn't become like other areas which have never been allowed to return, once mown.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrew
Perhaps you should speak to the guys that have brought this piece of land before making comments. There are always people too willing to have a pop before they know exactly what is happening and never enough to praise good work.
Reply ID 63887
All I can say is that the land looks ten times better than when it was populated by badly cared-for horses, ramshackle piles of scrap metal and sacks of wet horse feed. I suspect that it has been mowed to kick start natural habitat, as grasses need to be kept in check to allow wild flowers to flourish, otherwise the grass takes over. the horses that are there now are not the same poor things that were kept there before. I always wondered why someone wasn't prosecuted for the sorry state they were allowed to fall into. All power to whoever has bought the land. At least they got up off their a**es and DID something instead of just posting about it.
Reply ID 63888
quote:I do hope you're right Trisha. It would be such a shame to lose what has always been a haven for wildlife.
Originally posted by Trisha I suspect that it has been mowed to kick start natural habitat, as grasses need to be kept in check to allow wild flowers to flourish, otherwise the grass takes over.
Reply ID 63889
quote:For the moment I share your optimism. This is, after all, not a natural habitat, but an ancient one which has been managed by man for centuries and not always well. My concern is only because we have lost so much similar uncut watermeadow in my memory. Hartham, as previously mentioned, plus the area across Beane Rd, which is now Millmead estate and before that, the land behind and beside the Sele Arms/Bridgehouse. I've noticed a huge increase in small rodent activity in the small area that remains during the last couple of weeks, presumably as a result of the refugees seeking new cover. ultimately, these guys bought the land and the rest of us didn't. What they do with it is their business.
Originally posted by Trisha
All I can say is that the land looks ten times better than when it was populated by badly cared-for horses, ramshackle piles of scrap metal and sacks of wet horse feed. I suspect that it has been mowed to kick start natural habitat, as grasses need to be kept in check to allow wild flowers to flourish, otherwise the grass takes over. the horses that are there now are not the same poor things that were kept there before. I always wondered why someone wasn't prosecuted for the sorry state they were allowed to fall into. All power to whoever has bought the land. At least they got up off their a**es and DID something instead of just posting about it.
Reply ID 63891
Anyone would think that they are just about to build a multi story car park on it! Mind you that would please some!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply ID 63893
quote:So long as it will be pay on exit Victor [;)]
Originally posted by Victor Meldrew
Anyone would think that they are just about to build a multi story car park on it! Mind you that would please some!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply ID 63902
quote:No, [:I] of course I am not suggesting that Shunt, it would be ridiculous to even contemplate, but in view of the fact that horses are being grazed on part of the land, it would be mindful of the horse-owners to check for Ragwort which, is classed as a hazardous plant/weed. If you read the DEFRA report, this section from that Report suggests that it can be a problem if horses graze on it. Ragwort is a native species of the British Isles. It is a specified weed under the Weeds Act 1959. It contains toxins which can have debilitating or fatal consequences, if eaten by horses and other grazing animals. Ragwort is less likely to be rejected by stock if dried and contamination of forage (hay, haylage and silage) is a particular problem. Humans may be at risk from ragwort poisoningthrough direct contact (e.g. hand pulling) or the consumption of contaminated food. 4 This code does not seek to eradicate ragwort. Ragwort, as a native plant, is very important for wildlife in the UK. It supports a wide variety of invertebrates and is a major nectar source for many insects. In many situations ragwort poses no threat to horses and other livestock. It is a natural component of many types of unimproved grassland and is used by some invertebrate species that have conservation needs. However it is necessary to prevent its spread where this presents a high risk of poisoning horses and livestock or spreading to fields used for the production of forage. A control policy should be put in place where a high and medium risk is identified. 5 Ragwort is a highly successful species and in certain situations it can be difficult to control particularly where it has not been effectively managed for a number of years. I guess being a horse lover and horse owner, I am very aware of the Ragwort problem, and just wanted to mention it..ok? *J*[IMG]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/nature/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by shuntquote:The jury is still out on Ragwort killing horses, as far as I have been able to research. It's a rumour amongst equestrian circles, with some, as yet, unproven evidence that seems to suggest a link. However, even if it is true, we can't design the natural world just to suit horses.
Originally posted by Jayceequote:Totally agree - it certainly looks better, and if the mowing is to keep things (plants, etc) in check - i hope they watch out for Ragwort - as mowing does not get rid of this dreadful invasive plant - it has to be destroyed - taken away and burned, after removing roots and tubers.. as it is potentially lethal if eaten by horses!*J*[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/nature/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63909
quote:However, even if it is true, we can't design the natural world just to suit horses. Pity because it would be a much nicer place Shunt as I am a horse owner and breeder.........I also agree with Jaycee
Originally posted by shuntquote:The jury is still out on Ragwort killing horses, as far as I have been able to research. It's a rumour amongst equestrian circles, with some, as yet, unproven evidence that seems to suggest a link. However, even if it is true, we can't design the natural world just to suit horses.
Originally posted by Jayceequote:Totally agree - it certainly looks better, and if the mowing is to keep things (plants, etc) in check - i hope they watch out for Ragwort - as mowing does not get rid of this dreadful invasive plant - it has to be destroyed - taken away and burned, after removing roots and tubers.. as it is potentially lethal if eaten by horses!*J*[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/nature/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63911
quote:It wasn't when we tried it in the 19th century.[:D]
Originally posted by furrybunnyquote:However, even if it is true, we can't design the natural world just to suit horses. Pity because it would be a much nicer place Shunt as I am a horse owner and breeder.........I also agree with Jaycee
Originally posted by shuntquote:The jury is still out on Ragwort killing horses, as far as I have been able to research. It's a rumour amongst equestrian circles, with some, as yet, unproven evidence that seems to suggest a link. However, even if it is true, we can't design the natural world just to suit horses.
Originally posted by Jayceequote:Totally agree - it certainly looks better, and if the mowing is to keep things (plants, etc) in check - i hope they watch out for Ragwort - as mowing does not get rid of this dreadful invasive plant - it has to be destroyed - taken away and burned, after removing roots and tubers.. as it is potentially lethal if eaten by horses!*J*[img]http://www.smilies-and-more.de/pics/smilies/nature/040.gif[/img]
Originally posted by Bubbaoshea
I think it looks nice over there at the moment.
Reply ID 63943
If the cutting is to benefit wildlife it is essential that the cuttings are raked up and removed as otherwise they will rot down and increase the fertility of the ground which will encourage greater growth of vigourous grasses and nettles. One hopes that if the grazing is going to be a permananet feature that it is controlled for instance the over grazing under the old regime seems to have eliminated the many cowslips that used to grow on the bank against Beane Road
Reply ID 63946
quote:Resulting in cows displaying visible panty line under their party frocks? Nobody want's that.
Originally posted by Andrew
One hopes that if the grazing is going to be a permananet feature that it is controlled for instance the over grazing under the old regime seems to have eliminated the many cowslips that used to grow on the bank against Beane Road
Reply ID 63951
quote:[img]http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/bgr/lowres/bgrn895l.jpg [/img] Rather like this then Shunt? *J* [IMG]http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/bgr/lowres/bgrn895l.jpg
Originally posted by shuntquote:Resulting in cows displaying visible panty line under their party frocks? Nobody want's that.
Originally posted by Andrew
One hopes that if the grazing is going to be a permananet feature that it is controlled for instance the over grazing under the old regime seems to have eliminated the many cowslips that used to grow on the bank against Beane Road
Reply ID 63953
quote:Your viral archive must be vast jaycee. Something for every occasion.[:D]
Originally posted by Jayceequote:[img]http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/bgr/lowres/bgrn895l.jpg [/img] Rather like this then Shunt? *J* [IMG]http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/bgr/lowres/bgrn895l.jpg
Originally posted by shuntquote:Resulting in cows displaying visible panty line under their party frocks? Nobody want's that.
Originally posted by Andrew
One hopes that if the grazing is going to be a permananet feature that it is controlled for instance the over grazing under the old regime seems to have eliminated the many cowslips that used to grow on the bank against Beane Road
Reply ID 73744
Looks like it's had it's Spring manicure. Do we now have to accept that the haven for wildlife has been erased for ever?
Reply ID 73746
I haven't seen anyone fishing from the banks yet, though I did notice a wily fellow yesterday hanging a line from the bridge to tempt the trout.
Reply ID 73753
I see wildlife there every day. On the way to work in the morning i've seen pheshants, foxes, swans and deer to name but a few. Saying that the foxes may have got to the pheshants as i've not seen those this week......
Reply ID 73759
It's the wild grasses, insects and amphibians that used to flourish in the marshy area away from the river that I fear for. What was the point in destroying it?
Reply ID 73792
I did notice a yellow planning application notice, I forget the wording but I think that it was for planning to sort out drainage on the land, does this mean it will no longer be marsh land? are they are planning to build on the land?
Reply ID 73824
I think with this one they are never going to win. If they cut the grass they ‘erase the wildlife for ever’, but if they left the grass they would probably be accused of failing to maintain the site! If you knew the site at all, you would be aware that whilst the grass is nicely ‘manicured’ through the summer months, there still remains many areas of long grass and reeds, as well as plenty of marshy areas and a beautiful spring that I’m sure the insects and amphibians will manage to find. In addition, the cutting of the grass has no impact on the wet area - for that you must blame the sun! One final point - the land has been privately bought, so not wishing to be rude, but if you decided to fill in a pond in your garden or tarmac over your front garden to create a drive (which really would upset the wildlife!)- is it really any one else’s business?!
Reply ID 73825
quote:Yep. You can't just lay down a non-permeable surface these days or disturb the water system. Times have changed and landownwers are obliged to consider both drainage and wildlife.
Originally posted by Losh
I think with this one they are never going to win. If they cut the grass they ‘erase the wildlife for ever’, but if they left the grass they would probably be accused of failing to maintain the site! If you knew the site at all, you would be aware that whilst the grass is nicely ‘manicured’ through the summer months, there still remains many areas of long grass and reeds, as well as plenty of marshy areas and a beautiful spring that I’m sure the insects and amphibians will manage to find. In addition, the cutting of the grass has no impact on the wet area - for that you must blame the sun! One final point - the land has been privately bought, so not wishing to be rude, but if you decided to fill in a pond in your garden or tarmac over your front garden to create a drive (which really would upset the wildlife!)- is it really any one else’s business?!
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