Topic ID 2108
I was in Tottenham today. The experience got me to thinking that visits to Tottenham should be mandatory before allowing new users access to this forum. Users can then reflect on their Tottenham episode, which I'm sure would dilute their rancour on matters local.
Reply ID 28391
I have to visit that area on a regular basis. I, too, was there today. Park Lane and the surrounding areas are very imposing. I live on Sele Farm and have no problems with walking through it at night. I hate walking along Park Lane during the day even if I am with someone.
Reply ID 28393
I work in Wood Green,Nuff said [xx(]
Reply ID 28398
Whilst I'm musing on quality of life, I understand that the United States population today reached 300 Million. That works out at 100 million new participants to the American Dream in the last 40 years. Ooh err!
Reply ID 28401
My first flat away from the nest was in Tottenham - Vicarage Road, off Park Lane. A very pleasant couple of years. The estate agent thought she was bing very clever in driving me to the property from a side road off the High Street. I knew what i was buying - the ground was on the opposite corner from the block of flats. No trouble - it all happened once they got to Seven Sisters and the roads were swept clean after every Spurs home game as well as on its alloted day and the rest of the time it was very quiet because there was a huge empty playing field doing nothing for 13 days out of 14. I often had a drink in the Prince of Wales on Sundays. Very quiet pub until about 1.50pm when the band started up. Still going strong until about 5.00pm. No trouble, no hassle - just a good, honest Irish pub. Happy days. I rarely re-visited Tottenham after I moved out a few years before the riots. I was invited as a special guest to a box at WHL and I was saddened to see how much the High Street had changed. Miss the place as it was then - but as I think Herbert is trying to say; don't knock Hertford until you have experienced other places not a million miles away.
Reply ID 28402
Aye Mr Sloop. I guess that's what I'm getting at. I even found myself considering whether many of the people there were even aware that the quality of life in a place the size of Hertford even existed so close to them. It's an uncomfortably smug position to take, I know, but it's what my belly was telling me.
Reply ID 28403
quote:I knod towards the Melons belly. As a North London boy I do not recognise the sprawling durge I witness on my return and appreciate the qualities Hertford has to offer. I expect that eventually Hertford will be swallowed up by the expansion of London and I rue that day for I believe I will have had to have fled long beforehand. I sincerely hope that Hertford retains everything I value and me.
Originally posted by Herbert Lemons
Aye Mr Sloop. I guess that's what I'm getting at. I even found myself considering whether many of the people there were even aware that the quality of life in a place the size of Hertford even existed so close to them. It's an uncomfortably smug position to take, I know, but it's what my belly was telling me.
Reply ID 28404
"knod towards the Melons belly"... Is that code for something?
Reply ID 28406
quote:Merely a reference to your previous post.
Originally posted by Herbert Lemons
"knod towards the Melons belly"... Is that code for something?
Reply ID 28417
quote:Cor, thank'ee kindly, Mr Lemons, sir. See, Master won't let me out past the parish boundary very much, sir, so I'm right grateful for urbane gentlefolk like yer good self remindin' us plebs about how awful things is in The Smoke... What a spectacularly pointless post, Herbert. You may as well go on a railway enthusiasts' website and tell them they should be worrying about third world debt. Of course Hertford is a more pleasant environment than many other places. What's the point of this thread? Are we saying we should stop using this website to flag up concerns about trivial local issues and things in our community that concern us and just be grateful because things could be worse? It's a Hertford community website. If it is beneath your dignity to get motivated by issues like litter, traffic, crime, rubbish collection, planning laws etc, that's fine but please spare us the patronising twaddle about Tottenham. And isn't it very slightly worrying to read from the Town Centre Manager, 'Don't knock Hertford until you've experienced [worse places]' [:0] Why not? Hertford could be so much better! We need people to get steamed up about declining standards in our community and they should be able to do it on their own local community website without feeling they will be criticised for being negative and ungrateful.
Originally posted by Herbert Lemons
I was in Tottenham today. The experience got me to thinking that visits to Tottenham should be mandatory before allowing new users access to this forum. Users can then reflect on their Tottenham episode, which I'm sure would dilute their rancour on matters local.
Reply ID 28420
It would appear Mr Lemons needs direction on these matters Rachel. Herbert doesn't want to be a victim of his overly simplistic view so why don't you help him understand what opinions he should really have.
Reply ID 28421
I think Mr. Lemons was either Rachel baiting or simply attempting to express how much he enjoys living in Hertford. Shame on you Herbert, have you no gripes concerning litter, traffic, crime, rubbish collection, planning laws etc. to whinge about? What's wrong with you man?
Reply ID 28424
quote:On a Hertford Community Website are we not allowed to say how much we enjoy living here compared to other places? Who are you? The Forum police? Must remember only to use this website to moan, not to be positive about my home town.[V]
Originally posted by Rachelquote:Cor, thank'ee kindly, Mr Lemons, sir. See, Master won't let me out past the parish boundary very much, sir, so I'm right grateful for urbane gentlefolk like yer good self remindin' us plebs about how awful things is in The Smoke... What a spectacularly pointless post, Herbert. You may as well go on a railway enthusiasts' website and tell them they should be worrying about third world debt. Of course Hertford is a more pleasant environment than many other places. What's the point of this thread? Are we saying we should stop using this website to flag up concerns about trivial local issues and things in our community that concern us and just be grateful because things could be worse? It's a Hertford community website. If it is beneath your dignity to get motivated by issues like litter, traffic, crime, rubbish collection, planning laws etc, that's fine but please spare us the patronising twaddle about Tottenham. And isn't it very slightly worrying to read from the Town Centre Manager, 'Don't knock Hertford until you've experienced [worse places]' [:0] Why not? Hertford could be so much better! We need people to get steamed up about declining standards in our community and they should be able to do it on their own local community website without feeling they will be criticised for being negative and ungrateful.
Originally posted by Herbert Lemons
I was in Tottenham today. The experience got me to thinking that visits to Tottenham should be mandatory before allowing new users access to this forum. Users can then reflect on their Tottenham episode, which I'm sure would dilute their rancour on matters local.
Reply ID 28426
Is Rachel going to be hoist on her own petard *again*?
Reply ID 28458
I regularly go to the Haringey borough and the state of the streets is vile. They have a 'zero' zero-tolerancy view to rubbish left on the streets and regularly patrol the streets to remove as much of the mess as possible. They simply cannot keep up with the problem, hence the high council tax banding per capita. Newham and Hackney are even worse boroughs. Herbert's comment surely alluded to how nice Hertford is, which it is.
Reply ID 28464
Rachel - are you also known as Bono? It is almost possible to hear you seething with self-righteous indignation and your need to defend your perception of the under-dog. I can only assume you have never lived in Tottenham in the past 30 years to know it when it was a lovely place to live. If you had experienced the place, you too would understand why people appreciate this town more. I was born and raised there until my parents managed to sell up and move out to Hertford over 30 years ago. My father's family had lived in Bruce Grove since before the turn of the century. Throughout my teens I was able to witness the rapid decline of what had been a pleasant enough suburb and by the time my parents decided that their quality of life had become quite intolerable, Tottenham had become the sort of place that no-one would choose to remain in if there was a better alternative. Hertford has it's faults and we ALL moan and groan about the place. Perhaps you feel that our complaints should be made gravely and with sober and serious tone, and that we should all get offended on behalf of everyone else? I'm sure if you that if you got away from the rarified atmosphere from atop your soap-box you might understand more the fact that everyone who posts on this site, actually does so because they care about the topics, or they just have an opinion (which they are perfectly entitled to have) that isn't necessarily the same as yours, mine, whoever. What a sad, miserable and an**ly retentive world we would live in if we couldn't express ourselves in the variety of ways that we do. I for one would NEVER live in any part of London again, especially not Tottenham (which incidentally I do have the misfortune to have to visit from time to time). London is the place I go for specific needs: shopping/outings/theatre etc and it is also the place that I happily leave behind to come back to Hertford. I agree with Herbie and Sloops - Tottenham will make you appreciate Hertford more, it doesn't necessarily mean that we ignore our town's problems, or care less because we don't share your views.
Reply ID 28470
Hertford has it's problems, as does everywhere else, but I wouldn't want to live anywhere else! It's nice to hear positive stuff for a change so FWIW I say carry on Herbert! [:)]
Reply ID 28478
quote:Yes - and hopefully very soon! I love this place, it's a great place to live. Yes it has its troubles and problems, but thank whichever God you prey to that by comparison to Tottenham and Harringay (correct spelling before political correctness took over)ours are manageable. Before anyone plods the PC route, Harringay as per Harringay House Estate, has existed long before the introduction of Haringey in the 60s. It still exists as a place within the borough. Lighten up Rachel, your militant rants are neither wry, funny or particularly interesting. They're just rants.
Originally posted by Mr P
Is Rachel going to be hoist on her own petard *again*?
Reply ID 28480
quote:BR and the subsequent TOCs also refused to change the names of the 2 train stations. I can see why the PC brigade wanted to get of the second "a" but what was wrong with the other "r"? I wouldn't even move back to Cheshunt now. Hertford is the place for me.
Originally posted by gabriel Before anyone plods the PC route, Harringay as per Harringay House Estate, has existed long before the introduction of Haringey in the 60s. It still exists as a place within the borough.
Reply ID 28483
Rachel I think I know what you mean - I hope I made my own position clear. Herbert asked for other people's Tottenham experience, which I gave. It is sad that Tottenham has changed so much - see Fishwife. Most of the time my personal views are the same as my professional attitude and the real value of this site is that posters say what they think about Hertford, good and bad and I relay all this stuff upwards. 99% of the time no one takes the slightest bit of notice. What shines through most of the time is that everyone seems to love Hertford. I could write a book on what is wrong with the town but it would be the most boring piece of literature since Virgina Woolf threw herself off a lighthouse. On the other hand I have taken so many visitors around the town and the latest one was a lady from Norfolk who is working for the Hidden Britain campaign. She was amazed by the variety and depth of the history, architecture and culture of the town - I might have been having a good day. What I really find strange is that I am trying to build up the county town of Hertfordshire as a tourist attraction when its status should be self evident. I would not like it to be one of those lovely spots tourist never see but those who know never tell their friends. That negative attitude does us all a great disservice. Hertford has much to be proud of and we would not be human if we did not compare it to others. Many residents have followed the same route - North london, Tottenham, Enfield, Hertford. If Hertford is seen as the ultimate goal that is something to be really proud about.
Reply ID 28506
I won't have a word said against Tottenham. A constant supply of points every season.
Reply ID 28523
Interesting comments about Sele Farm on here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/panorama/6062008.stm
Reply ID 28532
There is a lot of "smugness" (is that a word?) on this forum about how lovely Hertford is. There are probably folk in Tottenham who love where they are and think it much nicer than other parts of London. They might even really dislike the snobby side of Hertford. IMO, there is a rotten side to Hertford and it is getting worse. Hertford is nice, compared to the surrounding towns. And as I have to live in this area, I am happy to be here. But it sure isn't heaven. I'm only here because Mr.Batty (born in Ware to N.London parents - who moved from the crap side of Enfield to Cheshunt to Ware) can't believe that there are nicer places to live. My choice would be Ludlow, but that'll have to wait until things in Hertford get so bad that even Mr.Batty agrees with me.
Reply ID 28539
Let's put it this way. How many houses do you know in Hertford where the owners have installed security doors and basr at the windows? Where I used to live in Finsbury Park, there are flats that have bars on the windows 3 floors up! A mate of mine who lives in Stoke Newington has to chain his bike to the stairs INSIDE his flat! We regularly leave our front door unlocked - even on the no-go area that is called Sele Farm. I don't know anyone that has been burgled or sexually assualted. I do know plenty of people that come into Hertford because they think it is a nice place.
Reply ID 28553
Before I was bitten by a radioactive boiled sweet and thus turned into Herbert Lemons, I was human too. Fate conspired and delivered me to 'your kind' by way of a place called 'Glasgow'. The conception of my re-animation wasn't immaculate and the delivery could have done with a few more practice goes. Anyhooo.. I have nothing against Tottenham and I can see that it has much to sell itself that Hertford could never have - popular sensitivity might call it 'cultural diversity'. Similarly Glasgow affects me through both pride & abhorrence in an almost feeble, pendular fashion. Frankly these are just examples of comparable urban centres - I happened to be in Tottenham. What struck me the other day (and was the motivation for this 'spectacularly pointless post'), were matters of scale. I am a proud Hertfordian and cannot imagine ever leaving the place. The spark was the paradox of me caring about 'my town' and the magnitude of its difficulties alongside places so close which would revel if they were only faced with our own municipal dysfunction. Hertford. Gorbless it. Tottenham. Gorbless it. Glasgow. 'Gorbals' it. (now I can walk away kicking my heels in delight of being able to shoehorn that line in)
Reply ID 28565
quote:Admit it Herbie, the initial and every subsequent posting of yours was a dastardly lead up to that very line! Tottenham? Haringay? Whaaat? Try "Ackney" "Ley uhn" and "Walfamstoe" to learn appreciation of our fine locale. Survive Fireworks Night bangers and rockets being lobbed at you at Dalston Junction, dodge gangs in Kingsland High Road and walk through some council estates in E10 & E17 and sense your neck hairs rising. We have a fine area here. Lets impose restrictions and declare Independence. Mr Lemons for President, Fishwife as Foreign Secretary, Shunt for Homeland Security (oops the Americans have that ok Minister for Administrative Affairs). Nominations please for the rest of our Government…
Originally posted by Herbert Lemons [Hertford. Gorbless it. Tottenham. Gorbless it. Glasgow. 'Gorbals' it. (now I can walk away kicking my heels in delight of being able to shoehorn that line in)
Reply ID 28566
Excellent idea 60sDJ. We could call this new place 'Dystopia-about-the-Beane'.
Reply ID 28578
quote:Ludlow is lovely, I agree. If I could afford the high prices, I'd get a second home there. Try and convince mr batty to move with you. Hertford is better in my opinion though - so many more nice things, along with non vindictive, spiteful moaning people. There are a few snobs though that moan about all sorts including the weather.
Originally posted by nora batty
My choice would be Ludlow, but that'll have to wait until things in Hertford get so bad that even Mr.Batty agrees with me.
Reply ID 28584
quote:That is a classic! [:D]
Originally posted by JohnSmith
A mate of mine who lives in Stoke Newington has to chain his bike to the stairs INSIDE his flat!
Reply ID 28598
One of the things I love about threads like this, is the way it illustrates how one man's cynicism is another's realism, just as optimism is as easily called delusion. Such a simple subject reveals so much of each individual contributor's core outlook on life. For me, remaining in Hertford has been a long fought battle, for both social and financial reasons and yes, I am a little smug that I'm still here. I've lived in South Oxhey, Palmers Green and Luton, all of which might be considered "rough" by comparison. In reality they were more physically threatening, but less emotionally challenging. In such places, anonymous and without cliques, there were no group to keep in with, only the assumption that the friendly guy you're drinking beer with might stab you if his team loses at football or your phone is newer than his. To survive in Hertford, there is only one trick. Learn not to care what people think of you or say about you.
Reply ID 38438
I've just returned from an 'interesting day' in Burnley. Say what you like about Hertford - at least (as far as I'm aware) we have not had to resort to UV mood lighting in public loos so the junkies are deterred because they can't see their veins. [8)]
Reply ID 38463
Must have missed this thread first time around. I think Rachel made a good a point! .
Reply ID 38482
My Nan comes from Burnley Leo and it is the most racist place I have ever been to.
Reply ID 38488
quote:Home of the BNP I think
Originally posted by Wrapper
My Nan comes from Burnley Leo and it is the most racist place I have ever been to.