Topic ID 1330
The thread on pronouncing Sele prompts me to ask how other local places should be pronounced. I've assumed Bengeo is Ben-gee-oh, but is it actually Ben-jo? Braughing is Braffing, and you pronounce the x in Furneux Pelham, but are there any others I should watch out for?
Reply ID 16117
Depends on if you're used to missing out a sillable (guilty) or spent an awful lot of time in far flung places, Ma though it was pronounced Ben-gay-o (10 years of Africa).
Reply ID 16118
quote:I think it's a Saxon word, meaning land ('geo) by the Beane (Ben') Not sure what Ben-gay-o is the Saxon for [:D]
Originally posted by farrowandfarrow
Depends on if you're used to missing out a sillable (guilty) or spent an awful lot of time in far flung places, Ma though it was pronounced Ben-gay-o (10 years of Africa).
Reply ID 16123
The one I've always wondered about as Hartham...pronounced Hart-ham or Harth-am? I know the first option is more sensible given the name of our town but I can't help but use the second [V]
Reply ID 16125
It's definitely Har-tum. What about Haultwick then? Artic, so I'm told.
Reply ID 16127
I've heard people pronounce Hertford as Haarford!
Reply ID 16136
Haultwick is Artic, just as Tonwell is Tunnel. Never heard of Bengeo being pronounced as Ben-jo in all my 34 years.
Reply ID 16137
Well, this thread has been very useful to me as it seems I've been happily pronouncing Sele and Braughing wrong for ages![:I]
Reply ID 16138
Could the pronounciations such as 'Haarford' and 'Benjo' be from the days of a regional dialect? (before the 'Norf London/Essex-ese infiltrated the area). As for Hartham being pronounced as Harth-am this grates on me as much as Cheshunt being Chesh-unt!
Reply ID 16140
quote:Sorry - I've been pronouncing it wrongly for 6 years now, there's no changing me now [}:)]
Originally posted by alison
Could the pronounciations such as 'Haarford' and 'Benjo' be from the days of a regional dialect? (before the 'Norf London/Essex-ese infiltrated the area). As for Hartham being pronounced as Harth-am this grates on me as much as Cheshunt being Chesh-unt!
Reply ID 16142
hertford, such be pronounced Are-fud. [;)] im not common, oh no....
Reply ID 16143
When I was a youngster and growing up in Hertford, the "posh" referred to it as Bengeo and us commoners called it Benjo! That reminds me, in my 1st year at Simon Balle Mrs Felts asked me for my address and I told her adding "Hartford, Hurts" - "Where does it hurt?" she kept asking until I fell in! [V]
Reply ID 16144
quote:Councillor Ruffles, Hertford born and bred, always pronounces it Haar-ford.
Originally posted by spitfire
I've heard people pronounce Hertford as Haarford!
Reply ID 16146
quote:I thought it was pronounced "Arfur", as in "Arfur Town, Arfur Town, Arfur Town (we are) Arfur Town, Arfur Town, Arfur Tow-n" [:D]
Originally posted by m1ckyg
hertford, such be pronounced Are-fud. [;)] im not common, oh no....
Reply ID 16158
And if you're Stevenage posh, it's St.Evenage...
Reply ID 16159
So let me get this all straight. I pronounce Hertford in the same way I would pronounce the first part of Hertfordshire, I guess it sounds like Hartford but I thought that was correct rather that Hurtford? Im newish to the area - Ive been called Hartham Har-tham since I arrived, had no idea it was Hart-ham - will correct this immdeiately. I also pronounced Sele as Se-lee not Seal as Ive now been told. And can I confirm how is Bengeo supposed to be said? Ive always assumed Ben-jee-o. Is that not right?
Reply ID 16160
My position is this: Ben-jee-o and ben-jo are both acceptable hartford is correct seal is correct
Reply ID 16161
Thanks for clearing that one up for me Steve.
Reply ID 16165
Looking up the pronounciation of "Hertford" on the Intranet site of a certain "British Broadcasting Corporation" gives... haartford, haarford... "County Town. Both pronunciations have vociferous proponents" (there is an acute over the first 'a' and a upwards semi-circle over the 'o' which in pronunciation terms means something but I can't copy the exact thing here) However everthing about 'Hertfordshire' has the former pronunciation (haartford) of the 'Hertford' bit. Also, Bengeo benjo (with an acute over the 'e' and a straight line over the 'o') -j as in jack And Braughing is 'braffing' I always have been led to believe that Hertford was 'haarford' and this was the way you knew a true resident of the town.
Reply ID 16172
Benjo Hartam Hartford Seal Hertford born and bred.
Reply ID 16174
quote:Don't you mean bjorn and bread!!!
Originally posted by 2929paul
Benjo Hartam Hartford Seal Hertford born and bred.
Reply ID 16183
Is that "Lowa Ben Jee O or "Upa Ben Jee O" ;-)
Reply ID 16201
Stan, You may have seen this before but for true Hertford residents, there is Hertford, then there is Bengeo. For Estate Agents, there is Lower Bengeo, just as there is the "desirable south side of town" or "popular Foxholes" development. And Cowper Crescent is "cooper", by the way, before anyone brings that up. Bjorn and bleedin' bread in harford - I shud ruddy no. Edited by Admin 20:05 04 Feb 2006
Reply ID 16212
Ah estsate agent speak..say no more. So Lower Bengeo is not really and area then ?
Reply ID 16276
All those born in Hertford (Moi) and living in Bengeo.. goes as follows. When you "live" in the locality, Bengeo is pronounced "Benjo"... Those who live in Cowper Crescent call it "Cow-per Crescent".. not cooper.. ! I have friends living in it since it was built.. so that settles that! Hertford has been called "Hurtford" by someone I know and "Harford" but again... we know what it means... Enjoy it..
Reply ID 16277
Sorry Drama Queen,unless I am mistaken Cowper Crescent was named after Francis Thomas de Grey, seventh Earl Cowper KG (1834-1905) as was the form Cowper at Richard Hale, now as I went to Richard Hale and was in the form Cowper which was, is and as far as I am lead to believe pronounced Cooper. Cowper Crescent should follow. Maybe the developers were unaware of the correct pronunciation on completion of the development.
Reply ID 16279
Cooper
Reply ID 16281
Name pronunciation often depends on how pompous you are! I have heard Hertford pronounced several differnt ways, but in the main HARTFORD. Maybe the HART on the top of the war memorial in Pariment sqaure is a strong indication on how our towns name should be pronounced. http://www.hertfordtown.fsnet.co.uk/history.htm The memorial was erected by public subscription on a site given by Sir Edward and Lady Pearson and was unveiled on Sunday 6 November 1921 by the Mayor of Hertford, Alderman James Burnett Smith MB, assisted by the High Steward of the Borough, the Marquess of Salisbury, KG, and the Archdeacon of St Albans, the Very Reverend The Hon Kenneth F Gibbs and the Reverend H R Cripps. A number of buildings known as Parliament Row were demolished to provide a site for the memorial, which at the time became (reputably) the first traffic roundabout in Britain. The memorial itself is built from the same Portland Stone as the Cenotaph. The architect for the memorial was Sir Aston Webb, PRA and Maurice Webb. Sir Aston Webb was elected President of the Royal Academy in 1919, and was succeeded by Frank Dicksee in 1924. Sir Aston Webb was the architect of many well-known buildings, designing the eastern façade of Buckingham Palace, Admiralty Arch, and the Cromwell Road front of the Victoria and Albert Museum. The distinctive hart atop the memorial is used by many Hertfordshire organisations as a symbol of the county in publications or on web sites. The sculptor Alfred Drury, RA was born in London in 1856. An accomplished sculptor he executed many public commissions, including the statue of Reynolds in the courtyard of Burlington House, four bronze figures for Vauxhall Bridge, and decorative sculpture for Leeds City Square.
Reply ID 16285
quote:According to Compo - who was in also in Cowper House at school - it is indeed pronounced COOPER.
Originally posted by 2929paul
Cooper
Reply ID 16287
I think as it is a noun and not a verb or adjective it is okay to mispronounce it until corrected. So, Cowper is fine until someone points out that it should be Cooper.
Reply ID 16288
For pronunciation of our town, take a tip from 'Enry 'Iggins. We live in a place where 'urricanes 'ardly hevver 'appen.
Reply ID 16289
quote:Ehh???
Originally posted by Ewoowar
I think as it is a noun and not a verb or adjective it is okay to mispronounce it until corrected. So, Cowper is fine until someone points out that it should be Cooper.
Reply ID 16291
quote:Come again?
Originally posted by Ewoowar
I think as it is a noun and not a verb or adjective it is okay to mispronounce it until corrected. So, Cowper is fine until someone points out that it should be Cooper.
Reply ID 16293
Farrow&Farrow should annotate the sign in their window to read: Braghing Sausages (pronounced braffing) ...so people worried about pronouncing it wrong will come in and buy them[;)]
Reply ID 16305
quote:Apologies...........I was in a rush...........I should have written 'proper noun'. What I mean is that proper nouns are more personal. So while you can make a mistake in the pronunciation initially, once it has been pointed out you should correct how you pronounce the word to avoid offence. Other types of words are not personal so you can pronounce them however you like even if it is incorrect.
Originally posted by nora battyquote:Ehh???
Originally posted by Ewoowar
I think as it is a noun and not a verb or adjective it is okay to mispronounce it until corrected. So, Cowper is fine until someone points out that it should be Cooper.
Reply ID 16309
quote:I think that's bullocks. I am pronouncing bullocks in the Saxon manner.
Originally posted by Ewoowarquote:Apologies...........I was in a rush...........I should have written 'proper noun'. What I mean is that proper nouns are more personal. So while you can make a mistake in the pronunciation initially, once it has been pointed out you should correct how you pronounce the word to avoid offence. Other types of words are not personal so you can pronounce them however you like even if it is incorrect.
Originally posted by nora battyquote:Ehh???
Originally posted by Ewoowar
I think as it is a noun and not a verb or adjective it is okay to mispronounce it until corrected. So, Cowper is fine until someone points out that it should be Cooper.
Reply ID 16316
quote:Or is that a Saxon manor? I didn't think your house was that old! [:D] What I mean is that it is courteous to use the correct pronunciation of a proper noun, particularly in the presence of those it relates to. I work with people from many countries and names are frequently mis-pronounced. But as soon as people are aware of the correct pronunciation they attempt to use it. I would consider it rude if people could not be bothered to use the correct pronunciation for my name once they knew it. If language differences made it difficult then it is more acceptable but generally speaking you make an effort. Otherwise poor old Siobahn might as well spell her name See-o-barn because she gets called that so often. The same goes with place names. I don't know the correct pronunciation for Braughing but if I did so I would use it.
I think that's bullocks. I am pronouncing bullocks in the Saxon manner.
Reply ID 16320
quote:Braffing as in laffing. (I am not fom the South). You'd think down here it would be Brarfing, as Southerners say larfing.
Originally posted by Ewoowar The same goes with place names. I don't know the correct pronunciation for Braughing but if I did so I would use it.
Reply ID 16323
quote:Not necessarily all do (or rather did).
Originally posted by nora battyquote:Braffing as in laffing. (I am not fom the South). You'd think down here it would be Brarfing, as Southerners say larfing.
Originally posted by Ewoowar The same goes with place names. I don't know the correct pronunciation for Braughing but if I did so I would use it.
Reply ID 16343
The Missus, born in Hertford General and lived in Bengeo all her life says Ben-ge-o.
Reply ID 16345
quote:Do you dare tell her she's wrong?[:D] And she was born in Hertford County Hospital. Bleedin' out of towners. Now run off back to Outer-Lower-Bengeo-By-the-Beane.
Originally posted by Victor Meldrew
The Missus, born in Hertford General and lived in Bengeo all her life says Ben-ge-o.
Reply ID 16350
My Missus born in the former DDR, wonders what all the fuss is about.
Reply ID 16355
Does living in Hertford since 1978 make me a bleedin out of towner then? But I do like the "Bengeo by the Beane" idea. I might start a residents assoc.
Reply ID 16466
my two pence: Cowper - IS Cooper Bengeo - IS Beng-eo Sele - IS Seal Simon Balle - IS Ball They all stem from olde English.
Reply ID 16468
quote:Yes[:)]
Originally posted by Victor Meldrew
Does living in Hertford since 1978 make me a bleedin out of towner then?
quote:Then she will probably understand all the regrettable fuss about the "Bengeo wall" to stop the rat run and separate Ben-jo/Ben-geo from the world. I can understand Germans/people from Germany being confused since pronunciation in their language is totally consistant and follows set rules. Very logical. Clinical. Efficient. Leaving no room for debate or argument. Does Wildeshausen have a discussion forum?
My Missus born in the former DDR, wonders what all the fuss is about.
Reply ID 16477
quote:Is a potential "Passport to Pimlico" situation occuring? [:)]
Originally posted by 2929paul
Then she will probably understand all the regrettable fuss about the "Bengeo wall" to stop the rat run and separate Ben-jo/Ben-geo from the world.
Reply ID 16481
Or would the Bengeo Wall be built to keep THEM in, rather than us out. I know what i would vote for.
Reply ID 16484
Watchit - I reckon your residence is just about within range of my trebuchet, Carlos!!!
Reply ID 16485
quote:How is that pronounced in Bengeo? I had no idea what a trebuchet was but a quick search has just informed me that in England, these were called Ingenium and technicians working on them Ingeniators (Engineers). My guess is that in Hertford, we would pronounce it "Bloody big catapult".
Originally posted by nora batty
Watchit - I reckon your residence is just about within range of my trebuchet, Carlos!!!
Reply ID 16486
'Benjo' is Japanese for toilet I believe.
Reply ID 16498
Interesting question Nora. Is your hill bigger than my hill?
Reply ID 16501
quote:According to my map I am at between 65 and 70m above sea level. It depends whereabouts you live on your hill - the highest point of your hill is about the same. For those of you listening at home, I am in Upper Bengeo.
Originally posted by carlos fandango
Interesting question Nora. Is your hill bigger than my hill?
Reply ID 16551
I think they should just scrap Bengeo and just call it Hertford. That way most of this argument would be eliminated. Bengeo is just a word to describe over-priced housing with a nightmare parking & rat-run problem
Reply ID 16554
quote:How can it be over-priced if that's what people will pay? It's down to supply and demand. If people are prepared to pay marginally higher prices to live in Bengeo it must have something going for it - even with a rat-run and parking problem (which only affects a small stretch of it anyway). I think the snobbery stems from the fact that estate agents have widened the boundaries in order to capitalise on this fact, and that doesn't always sit well with those that live within the old parish of Bengeo. I imagine the people of Fordwich Hill would feel the same if Sele began to be described as "Upper Fordwich".
Originally posted by thefair1973 Bengeo is just a word to describe over-priced housing with a nightmare parking & rat-run problem
Reply ID 16557
It was called Bengeo when I first moved in years back, and then Lower Bengeo a while later. Are the name changes made necessary by global warming, cliff erosion etc and in a decade or so will become known as Under Bengeo?
Reply ID 16559
quote:I like the idea that Bengeo is slowly sliding down the hill!!! As long as my house ends up outside the White Horse I'll be happy.
Originally posted by The Informer
It was called Bengeo when I first moved in years back, and then Lower Bengeo a while later. Are the name changes made necessary by global warming, cliff erosion etc and in a decade or so will become known as Under Bengeo?
Reply ID 16561
It certainly has its advantages. It now takes me 2.8 seconds less to reach the North station as opposed to 1998 - not to be sneezed at when time is of the essence.
Reply ID 16621
Upper Fordwich has a certain ring to it I have to say. But if we slide down the hill we finish outside the Bridge House. aaaarrrgghhhh.